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	<title>Comments on: The Mumbai Terror Attacks: Need For a Thorough Investigation: RH</title>
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	<description>media &#124; politics &#124; dissent</description>
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		<title>By: james</title>
		<link>http://kafila.org/2008/12/15/the-mumbai-terror-attacks-need-for-a-thorough-investigation-rh/#comment-5069</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[james]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Mar 2009 10:49:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kafila.org/?p=1576#comment-5069</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[This shocking, almost terrifying article reappeared in Tehelka magazine recently and I thus recently came across this discussion on this site.  I was relieved that I wasn&#039;t the only sceptic who could not be convinced by the &quot;official&quot; version.  As a Mumbai resident I am as confused as anyone else, but unable to just simply forget either.  I think it also reflects poorly on the mainstream media that it can forget so quickly.  Sometime in January there was an article in the Hindustan Times here in which Karkare&#039;s widow mentioned that it took the police 45 minutes to come to the aid of Karkare, salaskar and Kamte, and that during that 45 minutes at least 2 police vehicles with sirens on directly passed  the victims.  I don&#039;t believe this has been mentioned in the article and it is another strange element.  I have never been one for conspiracy theories but in this objective observation would point in that direction.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This shocking, almost terrifying article reappeared in Tehelka magazine recently and I thus recently came across this discussion on this site.  I was relieved that I wasn&#8217;t the only sceptic who could not be convinced by the &#8220;official&#8221; version.  As a Mumbai resident I am as confused as anyone else, but unable to just simply forget either.  I think it also reflects poorly on the mainstream media that it can forget so quickly.  Sometime in January there was an article in the Hindustan Times here in which Karkare&#8217;s widow mentioned that it took the police 45 minutes to come to the aid of Karkare, salaskar and Kamte, and that during that 45 minutes at least 2 police vehicles with sirens on directly passed  the victims.  I don&#8217;t believe this has been mentioned in the article and it is another strange element.  I have never been one for conspiracy theories but in this objective observation would point in that direction.</p>
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		<title>By: JB</title>
		<link>http://kafila.org/2008/12/15/the-mumbai-terror-attacks-need-for-a-thorough-investigation-rh/#comment-4415</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[JB]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 25 Dec 2008 06:03:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kafila.org/?p=1576#comment-4415</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[It is clear from the obscene reactions to Antulay’s comments that Congress does not want to rock the national boat at the moment. It was staggering to see how much unity the response to Antulay created across the entire political spectrum from ‘Muslims for Secular Democracy’ claiming they were ‘horrified’ by his comments (were they more than horrified by the terror attacks themselves? Is there a word for being more than horrified?) to the fascist parties baying for his blood and heaping abuse on him, even as some of them were simultaneously advocating the use of Hindu terror groups as the only response to ‘Islamic’ terrorism!!  India’s political culture is shot through with hypocrisy and it has been endlessly depressing to watch the aftermath to the terror strikes. If there was one thing the terrorists wanted, it was surely to create precisely this sort of panic reaction and mindless nationalism. Coming back to Antulay’s remarks, what precisely did he say beyond asking the perfectly sensible question – why was Hemant Karkare sent to Cama Hospital when there was a much bigger operation going on at the Taj and the other five-star hotels?  No one has produced any answer to that as yet! Moreover, we are given to believe that there is a ‘report’ in existence on the events of the 26th and days following, and that this ‘report’ settles the matter raised by Antulay’s queries. Indeed, if that is the case, why have the Indian public not seen the draft of this report? Why is there so little transparency about what happened? Why do the authorities prefer to ‘share’ information with the media in bits and pieces, fuelling speculation and contradicting their own earlier versions, rather than coming out, in a public and transparent way, with a single, integrated and definitive version that can be called ‘official’?  R.H.’s piece shows exactly why we need a thorough investigation by an agency that is not implicated in the events of 26-29 November, possibly Chidambaram’s NIA. Unless such an impartial investigation is made and its results communicated transparently, the ghastly terror strikes and the tragic death of Karkare and his colleagues will soon become our JFK. And that of course is what the fascist elements in Indian society want. They want to perpetuate a culture of political impunity where they can maim and kill ad lib, with no punishment or even arrests ever following. If the terrorists have their agenda of destroying democracy on the subcontinent, they couldn’t have better collaborators than the Sangh parivar and its political allies in India. And wasn’t that precisely what Karkare’s investigations were beginning to show?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It is clear from the obscene reactions to Antulay’s comments that Congress does not want to rock the national boat at the moment. It was staggering to see how much unity the response to Antulay created across the entire political spectrum from ‘Muslims for Secular Democracy’ claiming they were ‘horrified’ by his comments (were they more than horrified by the terror attacks themselves? Is there a word for being more than horrified?) to the fascist parties baying for his blood and heaping abuse on him, even as some of them were simultaneously advocating the use of Hindu terror groups as the only response to ‘Islamic’ terrorism!!  India’s political culture is shot through with hypocrisy and it has been endlessly depressing to watch the aftermath to the terror strikes. If there was one thing the terrorists wanted, it was surely to create precisely this sort of panic reaction and mindless nationalism. Coming back to Antulay’s remarks, what precisely did he say beyond asking the perfectly sensible question – why was Hemant Karkare sent to Cama Hospital when there was a much bigger operation going on at the Taj and the other five-star hotels?  No one has produced any answer to that as yet! Moreover, we are given to believe that there is a ‘report’ in existence on the events of the 26th and days following, and that this ‘report’ settles the matter raised by Antulay’s queries. Indeed, if that is the case, why have the Indian public not seen the draft of this report? Why is there so little transparency about what happened? Why do the authorities prefer to ‘share’ information with the media in bits and pieces, fuelling speculation and contradicting their own earlier versions, rather than coming out, in a public and transparent way, with a single, integrated and definitive version that can be called ‘official’?  R.H.’s piece shows exactly why we need a thorough investigation by an agency that is not implicated in the events of 26-29 November, possibly Chidambaram’s NIA. Unless such an impartial investigation is made and its results communicated transparently, the ghastly terror strikes and the tragic death of Karkare and his colleagues will soon become our JFK. And that of course is what the fascist elements in Indian society want. They want to perpetuate a culture of political impunity where they can maim and kill ad lib, with no punishment or even arrests ever following. If the terrorists have their agenda of destroying democracy on the subcontinent, they couldn’t have better collaborators than the Sangh parivar and its political allies in India. And wasn’t that precisely what Karkare’s investigations were beginning to show?</p>
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		<title>By: Debarshi</title>
		<link>http://kafila.org/2008/12/15/the-mumbai-terror-attacks-need-for-a-thorough-investigation-rh/#comment-4378</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Debarshi]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 22 Dec 2008 07:46:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kafila.org/?p=1576#comment-4378</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Prabhakar, let me begin by agreeing with you that it is impossible to shield the Islamic version/form of terrorism from a thorough as well as specific criticism. But there is a possibility that as we study the roots of the specific history of Islamic terrorism, we might have to confront other dirty truths about how the West has used and misused this kind of terrorism for its own purposes. 

It is indeed interesting to note that countries like Pakistan and Afghanistan are neither rich nor very powerful if compared to the Western countries and even India. How do you think powerful countries become powerful? For example, how was Britain very powerful once and now the US? Do you think it is possible to be a powerful country by being nice and fair or because of other reasons? And once powerful, do you think countries act benevolently vis-a-vis other countries? 

Let me change the track a bit. Would you say the poor in Pakistan would have more similarities with the Pakistani elite or with the Indian poor? Do you think religious and nationalist similarities can erase the fact that the poor suffer in a similar manner in every country? Don&#039;t you think the elite in Pakistan and India - despite their differences - enjoy a similar kind of privileged life? If yes, can we then really look at the human condition ONLY through nationalist and religious paradigms? We obviously can&#039;t, and you might agree so far with me hopefully. 

Now let us go back to the specific issue. There is obviously an Islamic terror threat looming across certain countries. It has to be definitely dealt with in a sensitively sharp manner. We can&#039;t allow this random and sporadic kind of hostage killing. But why I say &quot;sensitively&quot; is because we have to stop it without further aggravating it. If certain people are feeling mad enough to give up their lives for a cause which spreads terror, we have to go into the reasons. Doing so is not to fall into the trap of their self-justifications behind using terror. But it would at least enable us to just go beyond mere anger. 

Your angst seems to be about people not coming out in clear condemnation of Islamic terror and calling it by its name. As if if they do, your angst will end. Because then you will know, people of your country are all united in fighting Islamic terrorism. But will you be as passionately with these very people when they protest against farmers&#039; suicides, against the Narmada dam, for gay rights, against atrocities against Dalits, against killing of minorities in India? Are you sure you may not have a difference of opinion about these issues from many of them, just as some of them might have a difference of opinion with you on how to look at the larger problem of terrorism? 

Do you think those poor people living in villages, most of whom without the luxury of having televisions, would really bother about the Mumbai attacks so much? Do you think the family of those 1.5 lakh farmers who committed suicide would really care about how many people got killed in the Taj or Oberoi? Do you think these poor people won&#039;t bother about these deaths out of cynicism? Or because of some other, obvious reasons? What can those reasons be? 

Let me end this by creating another divide. We all know, terrorists are deliberately targeting well known cities to have the maximum political (and media) impact. I agree that just as villages and towns, these cities are as &quot;India&quot; as anything else. But surely not ONLY what is India - right? And I just pointed out how there are huge populations in India who may not bother so much about the Mumbai attacks. So when we are talking about coming together, who are the people we are referring to? And those people who are living with other, more acute, daily problems, what if they are not interested in the issue? Can we still claim to represent &quot;India&quot;? Do you think being nationalistic is an obviously exclusive privilege of those who live in cities? If not, then would you agree that whether we agree to come together on the issue of Islamic terrorism or not, we would have to infinitely struggle to ALSO fight together for the rights and the lives of many other people in this country? Don&#039;t you think that is what we owe to the people of this country?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Prabhakar, let me begin by agreeing with you that it is impossible to shield the Islamic version/form of terrorism from a thorough as well as specific criticism. But there is a possibility that as we study the roots of the specific history of Islamic terrorism, we might have to confront other dirty truths about how the West has used and misused this kind of terrorism for its own purposes. </p>
<p>It is indeed interesting to note that countries like Pakistan and Afghanistan are neither rich nor very powerful if compared to the Western countries and even India. How do you think powerful countries become powerful? For example, how was Britain very powerful once and now the US? Do you think it is possible to be a powerful country by being nice and fair or because of other reasons? And once powerful, do you think countries act benevolently vis-a-vis other countries? </p>
<p>Let me change the track a bit. Would you say the poor in Pakistan would have more similarities with the Pakistani elite or with the Indian poor? Do you think religious and nationalist similarities can erase the fact that the poor suffer in a similar manner in every country? Don&#8217;t you think the elite in Pakistan and India &#8211; despite their differences &#8211; enjoy a similar kind of privileged life? If yes, can we then really look at the human condition ONLY through nationalist and religious paradigms? We obviously can&#8217;t, and you might agree so far with me hopefully. </p>
<p>Now let us go back to the specific issue. There is obviously an Islamic terror threat looming across certain countries. It has to be definitely dealt with in a sensitively sharp manner. We can&#8217;t allow this random and sporadic kind of hostage killing. But why I say &#8220;sensitively&#8221; is because we have to stop it without further aggravating it. If certain people are feeling mad enough to give up their lives for a cause which spreads terror, we have to go into the reasons. Doing so is not to fall into the trap of their self-justifications behind using terror. But it would at least enable us to just go beyond mere anger. </p>
<p>Your angst seems to be about people not coming out in clear condemnation of Islamic terror and calling it by its name. As if if they do, your angst will end. Because then you will know, people of your country are all united in fighting Islamic terrorism. But will you be as passionately with these very people when they protest against farmers&#8217; suicides, against the Narmada dam, for gay rights, against atrocities against Dalits, against killing of minorities in India? Are you sure you may not have a difference of opinion about these issues from many of them, just as some of them might have a difference of opinion with you on how to look at the larger problem of terrorism? </p>
<p>Do you think those poor people living in villages, most of whom without the luxury of having televisions, would really bother about the Mumbai attacks so much? Do you think the family of those 1.5 lakh farmers who committed suicide would really care about how many people got killed in the Taj or Oberoi? Do you think these poor people won&#8217;t bother about these deaths out of cynicism? Or because of some other, obvious reasons? What can those reasons be? </p>
<p>Let me end this by creating another divide. We all know, terrorists are deliberately targeting well known cities to have the maximum political (and media) impact. I agree that just as villages and towns, these cities are as &#8220;India&#8221; as anything else. But surely not ONLY what is India &#8211; right? And I just pointed out how there are huge populations in India who may not bother so much about the Mumbai attacks. So when we are talking about coming together, who are the people we are referring to? And those people who are living with other, more acute, daily problems, what if they are not interested in the issue? Can we still claim to represent &#8220;India&#8221;? Do you think being nationalistic is an obviously exclusive privilege of those who live in cities? If not, then would you agree that whether we agree to come together on the issue of Islamic terrorism or not, we would have to infinitely struggle to ALSO fight together for the rights and the lives of many other people in this country? Don&#8217;t you think that is what we owe to the people of this country?</p>
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		<title>By: ranju radha</title>
		<link>http://kafila.org/2008/12/15/the-mumbai-terror-attacks-need-for-a-thorough-investigation-rh/#comment-4377</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[ranju radha]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 22 Dec 2008 07:28:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kafila.org/?p=1576#comment-4377</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[this exercise of tagging is the problem. and with which the &quot;terrorism&quot; being constructed culturally..
one cannot be blind to the amount of money spent by america to aid Bin Laden et al.(or in that case by various state players...take the case of Srilanka)
the business of global terrorism cannot be tagged to any particular religion/community even if one polemically does in order to serve one&#039;s vested intersts and run the business of demonising the Other. The &#039;master narratives&#039; of such acts would always be tagged whther we like it or not.. but should be condemned as &quot;terrorism&quot; cannot be tackled it or by the mere &#039;terror laws&#039;, &#039;military operations&#039;, &#039;state violence/terror&#039; (as pointed by aditya in one post)... the social has to be addressed socially... and the political, with political questions and answers... the rang de basanti anti-politics need not be the solution, rather it s the problem of such societal/political tensions...
the effort should be to think beyond a tagged mindset.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>this exercise of tagging is the problem. and with which the &#8220;terrorism&#8221; being constructed culturally..<br />
one cannot be blind to the amount of money spent by america to aid Bin Laden et al.(or in that case by various state players&#8230;take the case of Srilanka)<br />
the business of global terrorism cannot be tagged to any particular religion/community even if one polemically does in order to serve one&#8217;s vested intersts and run the business of demonising the Other. The &#8216;master narratives&#8217; of such acts would always be tagged whther we like it or not.. but should be condemned as &#8220;terrorism&#8221; cannot be tackled it or by the mere &#8216;terror laws&#8217;, &#8216;military operations&#8217;, &#8216;state violence/terror&#8217; (as pointed by aditya in one post)&#8230; the social has to be addressed socially&#8230; and the political, with political questions and answers&#8230; the rang de basanti anti-politics need not be the solution, rather it s the problem of such societal/political tensions&#8230;<br />
the effort should be to think beyond a tagged mindset.</p>
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		<title>By: Lazybug</title>
		<link>http://kafila.org/2008/12/15/the-mumbai-terror-attacks-need-for-a-thorough-investigation-rh/#comment-4375</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Lazybug]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 22 Dec 2008 07:08:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kafila.org/?p=1576#comment-4375</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&quot;Even if Kasab and Ismail had been shown photographs of Karkare, Salaskar and Kamte before they embarked on their trip, how could they possibly have identified the police officers in a dark alley in the dead of night according to Kasab’s first story? 

Yeah, how could they? In a dark alley, you cannot seea nything, not even the headlights of a police van!

According to later his confession, a police officer got out of the vehicle and started firing first, injuring him; how, then, did Ismail manage to kill the rest by himself?&quot;
WIth the kithcen knife he was  carrying of course, not the AK47.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Even if Kasab and Ismail had been shown photographs of Karkare, Salaskar and Kamte before they embarked on their trip, how could they possibly have identified the police officers in a dark alley in the dead of night according to Kasab’s first story? </p>
<p>Yeah, how could they? In a dark alley, you cannot seea nything, not even the headlights of a police van!</p>
<p>According to later his confession, a police officer got out of the vehicle and started firing first, injuring him; how, then, did Ismail manage to kill the rest by himself?&#8221;<br />
WIth the kithcen knife he was  carrying of course, not the AK47.</p>
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		<title>By: Prabhakar</title>
		<link>http://kafila.org/2008/12/15/the-mumbai-terror-attacks-need-for-a-thorough-investigation-rh/#comment-4373</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Prabhakar]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 22 Dec 2008 03:20:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kafila.org/?p=1576#comment-4373</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Debarshi, you do have a point.  It is unfortunate that terrorism has assumed religious tags.  But can we close our eyes to the reality that much of the terrorism being perpetrated today is in the name of religion?  That the mainstream in the respective religions has nothing to do with such acts is another thing.  It is inescapable that terrorism gets branded after the “cause” the terrorists espouse.  Therefore, those in Sri Lanka are called “Tamil terrorists”; those doing it in the name of Islam are called “Islamic terrorist” and so on.  The “damn-India, damn-Hindus” slacktivists raise a hue and cry that using the term “Islamic terrorists” is a conspiracy in the media to vilify Islam.  But this argument got completely debunked when, post-Malegaon, the term “Hindu terrorists” began gaining currency.  However much one may like to live in self-denial, it is a fact that the pan-Islamic terror movement across the globe is the single biggest threat to peace and security today.  An overwhelming majority of the Muslims are peace-loving and have nothing to do with this jehadi movement.  However, this would continue to be tagged with Islam, whether we like it or not.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Debarshi, you do have a point.  It is unfortunate that terrorism has assumed religious tags.  But can we close our eyes to the reality that much of the terrorism being perpetrated today is in the name of religion?  That the mainstream in the respective religions has nothing to do with such acts is another thing.  It is inescapable that terrorism gets branded after the “cause” the terrorists espouse.  Therefore, those in Sri Lanka are called “Tamil terrorists”; those doing it in the name of Islam are called “Islamic terrorist” and so on.  The “damn-India, damn-Hindus” slacktivists raise a hue and cry that using the term “Islamic terrorists” is a conspiracy in the media to vilify Islam.  But this argument got completely debunked when, post-Malegaon, the term “Hindu terrorists” began gaining currency.  However much one may like to live in self-denial, it is a fact that the pan-Islamic terror movement across the globe is the single biggest threat to peace and security today.  An overwhelming majority of the Muslims are peace-loving and have nothing to do with this jehadi movement.  However, this would continue to be tagged with Islam, whether we like it or not.</p>
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		<title>By: Debarshi</title>
		<link>http://kafila.org/2008/12/15/the-mumbai-terror-attacks-need-for-a-thorough-investigation-rh/#comment-4371</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Debarshi]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 21 Dec 2008 22:59:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kafila.org/?p=1576#comment-4371</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I think it is about time we please stop using &#039;Hindu&#039; and &#039;Muslim&#039; prefixes for terrorism and get out of this popular understanding because by pitting one against/with the other, we&#039;ll keep falling into a trap of communalizing the vocabulary of terror. Also, such prefixes make it easy for communalist and nationalist ideologues to take sides. If we keep focusing on &#039;networks of terror&#039;, which are increasingly seeming to have shadowy and multiple bases, and where larger games of national and international politics are being played out,  we might be able to give the readers a more complex and disturbing picture by keeping the easy dichotomies away.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think it is about time we please stop using &#8216;Hindu&#8217; and &#8216;Muslim&#8217; prefixes for terrorism and get out of this popular understanding because by pitting one against/with the other, we&#8217;ll keep falling into a trap of communalizing the vocabulary of terror. Also, such prefixes make it easy for communalist and nationalist ideologues to take sides. If we keep focusing on &#8216;networks of terror&#8217;, which are increasingly seeming to have shadowy and multiple bases, and where larger games of national and international politics are being played out,  we might be able to give the readers a more complex and disturbing picture by keeping the easy dichotomies away.</p>
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		<title>By: Prabhakar</title>
		<link>http://kafila.org/2008/12/15/the-mumbai-terror-attacks-need-for-a-thorough-investigation-rh/#comment-4370</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Prabhakar]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 21 Dec 2008 16:48:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kafila.org/?p=1576#comment-4370</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Sudha, it is pointless trying to find rationale in these theories.  Where is the question of Pakistani terrorists when according to the theory of RH, the whole episode is the handiwork of  Hindu terrorists?  No use trying to counter such rantings.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sudha, it is pointless trying to find rationale in these theories.  Where is the question of Pakistani terrorists when according to the theory of RH, the whole episode is the handiwork of  Hindu terrorists?  No use trying to counter such rantings.</p>
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		<title>By: ranju radha</title>
		<link>http://kafila.org/2008/12/15/the-mumbai-terror-attacks-need-for-a-thorough-investigation-rh/#comment-4368</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[ranju radha]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 21 Dec 2008 11:37:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kafila.org/?p=1576#comment-4368</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Antulay has shown the courage to say what &quot;simple minded&quot; Indians hesitate to utter even after being socially/culturally/politcally terrorised by hinduism/hindutva. one can&#039;t predict the way global terrorism operates. who knows abt RSS/VHP links to it? but can we reject it? NO. As their hindutva mission can take any form- we have seen its genocidal mission in Gujarat, Orissa, the way it operates to marginalise Dalit/Adivasi/Bahujans in urban/rural milieu are quite evident. The military, media, academia-- all fall for its terror missions. Antulay has given a wake up call against THIS terror. 
it is time for us to wake up 4m the &#039;patriotic sleep&#039; and think/act ...]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Antulay has shown the courage to say what &#8220;simple minded&#8221; Indians hesitate to utter even after being socially/culturally/politcally terrorised by hinduism/hindutva. one can&#8217;t predict the way global terrorism operates. who knows abt RSS/VHP links to it? but can we reject it? NO. As their hindutva mission can take any form- we have seen its genocidal mission in Gujarat, Orissa, the way it operates to marginalise Dalit/Adivasi/Bahujans in urban/rural milieu are quite evident. The military, media, academia&#8211; all fall for its terror missions. Antulay has given a wake up call against THIS terror.<br />
it is time for us to wake up 4m the &#8216;patriotic sleep&#8217; and think/act &#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Sudha</title>
		<link>http://kafila.org/2008/12/15/the-mumbai-terror-attacks-need-for-a-thorough-investigation-rh/#comment-4366</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Sudha]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 20 Dec 2008 18:20:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kafila.org/?p=1576#comment-4366</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Basically what RH is saying is the RSS and/or other assorted Hindu baddies, upon realizing that a terrorist attack was in progress, quickly mobilized their own terrorist cell, armed them with the same kind of weapons the actual terrorists were using and put them on the road where the actual attack was in progress. All in under about 15 minutes since the attack began – by far the fastest ever mobilization in the face of a chaotic terrorist attack, something even the Army would find difficult to achieve! The VHP/BD terrorists, being trained and skilled in the art of using grenades and AK-47s, matched the Pakistani terrorists in their usage of bullets, bombs and tactics. They were so smart that even the terrorists did not suspect that they were being shadowed by another group of armed men right behind them, on their trail!

These RSS terrorists as I shall call them then proceeded to stake out Sri Karkare who they knew was bound to come on that road to take on the Pakistani terrorists. They then managed to spot Karkare, Kamte and Salaskar in the vehicle. How they managed to do so when it is being claimed that the Pakistani terrorists could not have spotted them in the darkness is left as an exercise in fertile imagination to the reader; but it is just possible that the RSS terrorists were armed with Night Vision Goggles stolen from Army facilities. After all it is proven that about 60% of the Army has links with radical Hindutvavadis…

Back to the scene of action – the RSS terrorists, sure that their identities would be mistaken for the pakistanis’ pumped bullets into the three officers. However, for reasons unknown, they also entered Cama Hospital instead of heading home and distributing laddoos. There, the RSS walas revealed their stupidity by shouting in fluent Marathi before all and sundry for nearly an hour, thereby establishing their true identities before bolting out and disappearing into the night.

All this happened virtually in the footsteps of the rampaging Pakistani terrorists and yet the Pakistanis did not shoot them dead. This probably means that it was a joint operation by the RSS terrorists and their LeT counterparts in Pakistan.

This is what RH’s insinuating and frankly I have no words for it.

In the event of terror strikes, in my humble opinion, one simply cannot rely on eyewitness accounts or journalists jogging their memories. We have to rely on the outcome of the post-attack interrogation. Terrorists are trained to create mayhem by erratic movements, counter-intuitive actions and concealing their true intentions for the longest possible time once the attack is in progress. This is obviously to throw the responding forces off-track and ensure a high level of chaos that adds to their first-mover advantage. People who do not understand terrorist modus operandi must shut up and not reveal their ignorance for all to see.

Even if Karkare was on the hitlist of “Hindu terrorists” as the usual suspects are fond of parroting nowadays, how could these forces have reacted with the degree of speed and precision that makes everything look like the Pakistani terrorists did it? Did the RSS have terrorists ready and loaded and waiting in Mumbai for just such an attack to materialize? Or did the old dog Sudarshan respond at the speed of light to outfit terrorists with AK-47s, munitions and directions necessary to get them on the ground for the killing minutes after getting the information presumably through the TV?

All this is entirely untenable unless you also suggest that the killers of Karkare were actually hand-in-glove with the Pakistani terrorists themselves. Or are you suggesting there were no Pakistani terrorists and it was all an in-house job by the RSS to malign Pakistan, kill Karkare and also enough Hindu Indians to provoke an outrage against Muslims and hopefully a riot or two?

If this is what is being arrived at, I’d put such people at the level of zaid Hamid and other canine conspiracy-mongers of his ilk.  Not worth further comment.

It goes to show just how much some Muslims have lost the plot here when they applaud the rabid communalist Antulay question the events leading to the deaths of brave police officers. The Congress is no friends of the Hindus and would happily malign a few Hindutva types to corner Muslim votes (using something like the Malegaon blasts probe for example). But even this farcically secular party can only go so far to hide the truth from the public. Muslim terrorists go on a rampage killing hundreds and an old fool comes up with is a bizarre conspiracy theory that is idiotic as much as it is repulsive.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Basically what RH is saying is the RSS and/or other assorted Hindu baddies, upon realizing that a terrorist attack was in progress, quickly mobilized their own terrorist cell, armed them with the same kind of weapons the actual terrorists were using and put them on the road where the actual attack was in progress. All in under about 15 minutes since the attack began – by far the fastest ever mobilization in the face of a chaotic terrorist attack, something even the Army would find difficult to achieve! The VHP/BD terrorists, being trained and skilled in the art of using grenades and AK-47s, matched the Pakistani terrorists in their usage of bullets, bombs and tactics. They were so smart that even the terrorists did not suspect that they were being shadowed by another group of armed men right behind them, on their trail!</p>
<p>These RSS terrorists as I shall call them then proceeded to stake out Sri Karkare who they knew was bound to come on that road to take on the Pakistani terrorists. They then managed to spot Karkare, Kamte and Salaskar in the vehicle. How they managed to do so when it is being claimed that the Pakistani terrorists could not have spotted them in the darkness is left as an exercise in fertile imagination to the reader; but it is just possible that the RSS terrorists were armed with Night Vision Goggles stolen from Army facilities. After all it is proven that about 60% of the Army has links with radical Hindutvavadis…</p>
<p>Back to the scene of action – the RSS terrorists, sure that their identities would be mistaken for the pakistanis’ pumped bullets into the three officers. However, for reasons unknown, they also entered Cama Hospital instead of heading home and distributing laddoos. There, the RSS walas revealed their stupidity by shouting in fluent Marathi before all and sundry for nearly an hour, thereby establishing their true identities before bolting out and disappearing into the night.</p>
<p>All this happened virtually in the footsteps of the rampaging Pakistani terrorists and yet the Pakistanis did not shoot them dead. This probably means that it was a joint operation by the RSS terrorists and their LeT counterparts in Pakistan.</p>
<p>This is what RH’s insinuating and frankly I have no words for it.</p>
<p>In the event of terror strikes, in my humble opinion, one simply cannot rely on eyewitness accounts or journalists jogging their memories. We have to rely on the outcome of the post-attack interrogation. Terrorists are trained to create mayhem by erratic movements, counter-intuitive actions and concealing their true intentions for the longest possible time once the attack is in progress. This is obviously to throw the responding forces off-track and ensure a high level of chaos that adds to their first-mover advantage. People who do not understand terrorist modus operandi must shut up and not reveal their ignorance for all to see.</p>
<p>Even if Karkare was on the hitlist of “Hindu terrorists” as the usual suspects are fond of parroting nowadays, how could these forces have reacted with the degree of speed and precision that makes everything look like the Pakistani terrorists did it? Did the RSS have terrorists ready and loaded and waiting in Mumbai for just such an attack to materialize? Or did the old dog Sudarshan respond at the speed of light to outfit terrorists with AK-47s, munitions and directions necessary to get them on the ground for the killing minutes after getting the information presumably through the TV?</p>
<p>All this is entirely untenable unless you also suggest that the killers of Karkare were actually hand-in-glove with the Pakistani terrorists themselves. Or are you suggesting there were no Pakistani terrorists and it was all an in-house job by the RSS to malign Pakistan, kill Karkare and also enough Hindu Indians to provoke an outrage against Muslims and hopefully a riot or two?</p>
<p>If this is what is being arrived at, I’d put such people at the level of zaid Hamid and other canine conspiracy-mongers of his ilk.  Not worth further comment.</p>
<p>It goes to show just how much some Muslims have lost the plot here when they applaud the rabid communalist Antulay question the events leading to the deaths of brave police officers. The Congress is no friends of the Hindus and would happily malign a few Hindutva types to corner Muslim votes (using something like the Malegaon blasts probe for example). But even this farcically secular party can only go so far to hide the truth from the public. Muslim terrorists go on a rampage killing hundreds and an old fool comes up with is a bizarre conspiracy theory that is idiotic as much as it is repulsive.</p>
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		<title>By: Prabhakar</title>
		<link>http://kafila.org/2008/12/15/the-mumbai-terror-attacks-need-for-a-thorough-investigation-rh/#comment-4365</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Prabhakar]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 20 Dec 2008 15:57:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kafila.org/?p=1576#comment-4365</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I do not understand the controversy over Antulay&#039;s remarks.  It is one thing that Karkare has been established to have been killed by the Pakistani terrorists.  But isn&#039;t it a possibility that the Hindutva terrorists also could have had an interest in eliminating him?  Why chastise Antulay for asking this question?  If the Pakistani terrorists did not kill Karkare, they still killed 200-odd others, and not killing Karkare doesn&#039;t make their acts and the support of their masters across the border any less reprehensible.  

RH has tried to put up a spirited defence for Pakistan and to imply that the terrorists were Hindus and not Muslims from Pakistan.  Even the Pakistani media has produced incontrovertible evidence for where Kasab comes from, endorsed by none other than Navaz Sharif.  Here is a soul who would make Zardari and Hamid Gul proud!  Great work, brother!  It takes all kinds to make this world!!]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I do not understand the controversy over Antulay&#8217;s remarks.  It is one thing that Karkare has been established to have been killed by the Pakistani terrorists.  But isn&#8217;t it a possibility that the Hindutva terrorists also could have had an interest in eliminating him?  Why chastise Antulay for asking this question?  If the Pakistani terrorists did not kill Karkare, they still killed 200-odd others, and not killing Karkare doesn&#8217;t make their acts and the support of their masters across the border any less reprehensible.  </p>
<p>RH has tried to put up a spirited defence for Pakistan and to imply that the terrorists were Hindus and not Muslims from Pakistan.  Even the Pakistani media has produced incontrovertible evidence for where Kasab comes from, endorsed by none other than Navaz Sharif.  Here is a soul who would make Zardari and Hamid Gul proud!  Great work, brother!  It takes all kinds to make this world!!</p>
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		<title>By: Nivedita Menon</title>
		<link>http://kafila.org/2008/12/15/the-mumbai-terror-attacks-need-for-a-thorough-investigation-rh/#comment-4364</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Nivedita Menon]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 20 Dec 2008 14:13:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kafila.org/?p=1576#comment-4364</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[rohitkaliyar - did you ever actually see Rashomon?   You seem to think that &quot;Rashomon effect&quot; refers to crazy alternative scenarios about one clear truth, when in fact what the film did was precisely to question the idea that there can be one and only one truthful account of an event, and to foreground the importance of perception on how an incident is remembered.
In other words, you are way off the mark when you use Rashomon&#039;s authority to mock the questions that RH raises here. RH is not alone in these doubts - I had in earlier post, pointed to the suspicious nature of Karkare&#039;s death, and now Antulay has come right out and said it.
Of course, unfortunately, the fact that he is Muslim makes it easy to attack him as &quot;taking the heat off Pakistan&quot;, and media reports about &quot;Muslim support&quot; for Antulay&#039;s theory deliberately delegitimize a concern shared by many Indians, and not only Muslims.
It is also a red herring to rant as the media and the BJP and so on have been, that we need to combat terrorism, and not raise such doubts - the two are not mutually exclusive courses of action. None of those I mention here who raise these doubts, claims that the entire operation was meant to eliminate Karkare. But certainly it was a very convenient time to take out someone already on a hit list.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>rohitkaliyar &#8211; did you ever actually see Rashomon?   You seem to think that &#8220;Rashomon effect&#8221; refers to crazy alternative scenarios about one clear truth, when in fact what the film did was precisely to question the idea that there can be one and only one truthful account of an event, and to foreground the importance of perception on how an incident is remembered.<br />
In other words, you are way off the mark when you use Rashomon&#8217;s authority to mock the questions that RH raises here. RH is not alone in these doubts &#8211; I had in earlier post, pointed to the suspicious nature of Karkare&#8217;s death, and now Antulay has come right out and said it.<br />
Of course, unfortunately, the fact that he is Muslim makes it easy to attack him as &#8220;taking the heat off Pakistan&#8221;, and media reports about &#8220;Muslim support&#8221; for Antulay&#8217;s theory deliberately delegitimize a concern shared by many Indians, and not only Muslims.<br />
It is also a red herring to rant as the media and the BJP and so on have been, that we need to combat terrorism, and not raise such doubts &#8211; the two are not mutually exclusive courses of action. None of those I mention here who raise these doubts, claims that the entire operation was meant to eliminate Karkare. But certainly it was a very convenient time to take out someone already on a hit list.</p>
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		<title>By: rohitkaliyar</title>
		<link>http://kafila.org/2008/12/15/the-mumbai-terror-attacks-need-for-a-thorough-investigation-rh/#comment-4346</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[rohitkaliyar]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 17 Dec 2008 21:34:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kafila.org/?p=1576#comment-4346</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Rashomon effect!!

Thank you Akira Kurosawa for making a movie called &#039;Rashomon&#039; in early 50&#039;s, I think, a remake is long due and this event will certainly make a good plot for one such movie.
Even when I am writing this, some more possibilities are coming in my mind. In one story we can have Pragya Thakur playing part, by making her come out of the prison, through another interesting story, for killing Karkare. In another, Lt. Col. Purohit can play the role of assassin, even Praveen Togadia can be allowed to become part of one of the segment, he can be shown killing with a &#039;Trishul&#039; followed by gun shots.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Rashomon effect!!</p>
<p>Thank you Akira Kurosawa for making a movie called &#8216;Rashomon&#8217; in early 50&#8242;s, I think, a remake is long due and this event will certainly make a good plot for one such movie.<br />
Even when I am writing this, some more possibilities are coming in my mind. In one story we can have Pragya Thakur playing part, by making her come out of the prison, through another interesting story, for killing Karkare. In another, Lt. Col. Purohit can play the role of assassin, even Praveen Togadia can be allowed to become part of one of the segment, he can be shown killing with a &#8216;Trishul&#8217; followed by gun shots.</p>
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		<title>By: SC</title>
		<link>http://kafila.org/2008/12/15/the-mumbai-terror-attacks-need-for-a-thorough-investigation-rh/#comment-4310</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[SC]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 16 Dec 2008 06:26:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kafila.org/?p=1576#comment-4310</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Who is the author RH?? If he is raising questions then let us reiterate that this is not fiction writing....this is true terrror and people have been killed and it is also the truth that there are terrorists out there on the other side of the border who are inspiring feud and disablity in the youth here. Samjhauta was not anyone&#039;s figment of fantasy...it is to be understood that like all bollywood movies stories are not cooked up here to mislead investigators. This is real life. India had enough courage to investigate its own wrong-doers and curb terrorism in all its forms by trying out sandhus and sadhvis. Is Pakistan able to bring to book the killers of its brave leader, Benazir? So who needs to pull up socks and talk about thorough investigations? Its time we woke up before destruction raises its ugly neck while we are at each others throats guzzling fiction and crying hoarse the uncertainties surrounding us.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Who is the author RH?? If he is raising questions then let us reiterate that this is not fiction writing&#8230;.this is true terrror and people have been killed and it is also the truth that there are terrorists out there on the other side of the border who are inspiring feud and disablity in the youth here. Samjhauta was not anyone&#8217;s figment of fantasy&#8230;it is to be understood that like all bollywood movies stories are not cooked up here to mislead investigators. This is real life. India had enough courage to investigate its own wrong-doers and curb terrorism in all its forms by trying out sandhus and sadhvis. Is Pakistan able to bring to book the killers of its brave leader, Benazir? So who needs to pull up socks and talk about thorough investigations? Its time we woke up before destruction raises its ugly neck while we are at each others throats guzzling fiction and crying hoarse the uncertainties surrounding us.</p>
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