Comments on: Requiem for a Movement http://kafila.org/2009/06/21/requeim-for-a-movement/ media | politics | dissent Sun, 07 Mar 2010 11:17:41 +0000 http://wordpress.com/ hourly 1 By: Aditya Nigam http://kafila.org/2009/06/21/requeim-for-a-movement/#comment-6349 Aditya Nigam Thu, 25 Jun 2009 06:08:01 +0000 http://kafila.org/?p=2865#comment-6349 Thanks Prasanta. This article was quite useful. Both the questions you raise are of critical importance. The second question first. I am not for a parallel state-within-state that replicates all the coercions that a state does and more. Extortion becomes the form of random, forced and whimsical taxation when that happens and cannot be a real option for any serious politics. Rather than mirror the state thus, I look more hopefully at smaller experiments - say of the kind the Ganesh Devy and all are trying in building a Green Economic Zone. These function - if and when they succeed - not by mimicking the state but by producing range of counter practices, even while encouraging normal entrepreneurship and trade relationship within and with others outside. On your first question as well, I find more possibilities in the second model. Such a model, of course can work only when it learns how to function in the interstices of power and state institutions. However, it is easier said than done. And Shivam, the link you provided was very very interesting and illuminating - also moving. Thanks Prasanta. This article was quite useful. Both the questions you raise are of critical importance. The second question first. I am not for a parallel state-within-state that replicates all the coercions that a state does and more. Extortion becomes the form of random, forced and whimsical taxation when that happens and cannot be a real option for any serious politics. Rather than mirror the state thus, I look more hopefully at smaller experiments – say of the kind the Ganesh Devy and all are trying in building a Green Economic Zone. These function – if and when they succeed – not by mimicking the state but by producing range of counter practices, even while encouraging normal entrepreneurship and trade relationship within and with others outside.
On your first question as well, I find more possibilities in the second model. Such a model, of course can work only when it learns how to function in the interstices of power and state institutions. However, it is easier said than done.
And Shivam, the link you provided was very very interesting and illuminating – also moving.

]]> By: Prasanta Chakravarty http://kafila.org/2009/06/21/requeim-for-a-movement/#comment-6334 Prasanta Chakravarty Wed, 24 Jun 2009 03:04:02 +0000 http://kafila.org/?p=2865#comment-6334 Dear Aditya, In today's "The Telegraph", one Pronab Mondal (Rise and Rot of A Rebel State) touches on some points that that you discuss, but with a twist. I am not privy to his ideological motivations, but a couple of points may be worth pondering for those invested in the kind of democratic experiment that you delineate. One, is there some structural limitation to the very idea of free zone (muktanchal), which after exhausting basic democratic needs--economic and political--needs to address some thorny issues, like trade or art or foreign policy. In other words, for those of us invested in varities of of democratic municipalism/communitarinism, is scaling of the structure itself an issue? This is not to say there is anything natural about the nation state as a proper scale. The other point is about ways of generating income (if extortion is not a long term option) in such democratic experiments. What ought to be the nature of cooperation in the long term. Am just thinking aloud. Dear Aditya,

In today’s “The Telegraph”, one Pronab Mondal (Rise and Rot of A Rebel State) touches on some points that that you discuss, but with a twist. I am not privy to his ideological motivations, but a couple of points may be worth pondering for those invested in the kind of democratic experiment that you delineate. One, is there some structural limitation to the very idea of free zone (muktanchal), which after exhausting basic democratic needs–economic and political–needs to address some thorny issues, like trade or art or foreign policy. In other words, for those of us invested in varities of of democratic municipalism/communitarinism, is scaling of the structure itself an issue? This is not to say there is anything natural about the nation state as a proper scale. The other point is about ways of generating income (if extortion is not a long term option) in such democratic experiments. What ought to be the nature of cooperation in the long term. Am just thinking aloud.

]]> By: Rageina http://kafila.org/2009/06/21/requeim-for-a-movement/#comment-6323 Rageina Tue, 23 Jun 2009 06:27:52 +0000 http://kafila.org/?p=2865#comment-6323 The villagers have fallen prey to the maoists. Instead of an intense democratic protest the maoists have forced the villagers into a deadly Armed struggle. If you believe in violence you shouldn't be complaining and talk of human rights and justice. At the end Might will be Right. The Indian state or the Maoists. Who will win is quite obvious. The villagers have fallen prey to the maoists. Instead of an intense democratic protest the maoists have forced the villagers into a deadly Armed struggle. If you believe in violence you shouldn’t be complaining and talk of human rights and justice. At the end Might will be Right. The Indian state or the Maoists. Who will win is quite obvious.

]]> By: Rageina http://kafila.org/2009/06/21/requeim-for-a-movement/#comment-6322 Rageina Tue, 23 Jun 2009 06:18:52 +0000 http://kafila.org/?p=2865#comment-6322 "When the CPM and the Indian state have eliminated all possibilities of democratic dissent, all that is left is is the Maoist strategy of armed struggle that has no room for any anti-state voices except itself." How long do you think the Maoists can sustain the armed struggle against the might of India. Democratic dissent was the only option left for them which they squandered away. “When the CPM and the Indian state have eliminated all possibilities of democratic dissent, all that is left is is the Maoist strategy of armed struggle that has no room for any anti-state voices except itself.”

How long do you think the Maoists can sustain the armed struggle against the might of India. Democratic dissent was the only option left for them which they squandered away.

]]> By: palakmathur http://kafila.org/2009/06/21/requeim-for-a-movement/#comment-6308 palakmathur Sun, 21 Jun 2009 18:47:33 +0000 http://kafila.org/?p=2865#comment-6308 This was a nice article. Indian state has failed to promote and provide social, political and economical justice and equality of opportunity to the people who have for long lived under the conditions of high level of poverty and destitution. The fundamental rights and directive principles of state policy guide towards the same and enjoin government to strive to achieve them. The Central Government comes out with various schemes to take care of all the citizens, but we lack when it comes to make these schemes reach to the people for whom these are meant for. The system lacks in accountability. If there is accountability at various levels, then surely we can reach to the masses at a frequent pace and that too before any anti-state element. We boast of being the leader in IT and when it comes to e-governance, we work on few applications and believe that we have e-governance. The e-governance is much more than that. If we could use our IT prowess to implement an all-in-one and truly e-governance system which will include grievance reporting, resource monitoring, undercurrents monitoring etc. then we can certainly be sure of reducing such incidents and reach people and have their voice listened and acted upon. This was a nice article. Indian state has failed to promote and provide social, political and economical justice and equality of opportunity to the people who have for long lived under the conditions of high level of poverty and destitution. The fundamental rights and directive principles of state policy guide towards the same and enjoin government to strive to achieve them. The Central Government comes out with various schemes to take care of all the citizens, but we lack when it comes to make these schemes reach to the people for whom these are meant for. The system lacks in accountability. If there is accountability at various levels, then surely we can reach to the masses at a frequent pace and that too before any anti-state element.

We boast of being the leader in IT and when it comes to e-governance, we work on few applications and believe that we have e-governance. The e-governance is much more than that. If we could use our IT prowess to implement an all-in-one and truly e-governance system which will include grievance reporting, resource monitoring, undercurrents monitoring etc. then we can certainly be sure of reducing such incidents and reach people and have their voice listened and acted upon.

]]> By: Shivam Vij http://kafila.org/2009/06/21/requeim-for-a-movement/#comment-6303 Shivam Vij Sun, 21 Jun 2009 16:06:17 +0000 http://kafila.org/?p=2865#comment-6303 An excellent piece, Aditya. The media discourse on Lalgarh is driven primarily by the fact that involves "Maoists" and like "terrorists", once the word has been uttered, there is nothing left to explain. But there's an excellent piece in HT today, particularly remarkable because it comes from the consulting editor of a business paper. See <a href="http://www.hindustantimes.com/StoryPage/StoryPage.aspx?sectionName=HomePage&id=53f56ee3-27c4-4625-894d-f27664b9479e&Headline=Lalgarh+ke+sholay" rel="nofollow">Lalgarh ke Sholay</a>. An excellent piece, Aditya. The media discourse on Lalgarh is driven primarily by the fact that involves “Maoists” and like “terrorists”, once the word has been uttered, there is nothing left to explain. But there’s an excellent piece in HT today, particularly remarkable because it comes from the consulting editor of a business paper. See Lalgarh ke Sholay.

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